FEATURED

BERRY BROS AND RUDD - DOUG McIVOR

This interview with Doug McIvor took place on 3 February 2009. We were sitting in the Parlour of Berry Brothers and Rudd’s London shop, where in 1923 the partners had the concept of a light coloured, approachable but high quality blended whisky – James McBey sketched out the line drawing – and the Cutty Sark Whisky was born.

GrainMash : Doug McIvor, whisky expert and guru, Keeper of the Quaich, we finally meet. You must be very grateful I agreed to rearrange. But joking aside, will you start by telling us a little about your career before joining Berry Brothers?

Doug McIvor : I’ve been working for BBR for 7 years now but broadly in the wine and spirits trade for 23 years. I started in the wine trade, progressed through specialist beers, and then in 1990, I answered an ad for a wine salesman required for a small family company, a wine merchant in Soho London.

And when I got there, I discovered that half the space was given over to whisky. And always having enjoyed a dram or two, I thought this looked like a pretty heavenly place. The company was called Milroys. By the time I left, 10 years later, we were not selling any wines, just whisky, and we had built the range up to about 1200 whiskies from around the world.

GrainMash : And then opportunity arose to join the world famous Berry Brothers and Rudd?

Doug McIver : Yes. Initially the role was to build up the sales of spirits in the London shop here, and then I took over the spirits buying duties and since then I have developed the range of whiskies and rums under the BBR “Berrys Own Selection” range.

There are two divisions here. On the other side of the company is Cutty Sark and Glenrothes, which is a global marketing operation, whilst I work for the wine division of the company, looking after spirits.

GrainMash : So how large is the range of whiskies currently available from Berry Brothers?

Doug McIvor : Well, 7 years ago we had a range of about 70 or 80, and now we are at around 400 different whiskies. But we are not trying to be like some of our competitors, and stock everything. We are trying to assemble a range that represents best quality and value for our customers.

GrainMash : And what service are Berry Brothers trying to offer the customers?

Doug McIvor : Some of our customers are very knowledgeable. Some come to Berry Brothers because they trust our knowledge and what we stand for. We have three very passionate people working in the spirits team and we try to pass our enthusiasm to other members of the company. So it doesn’t matter if you are with the staff here in the shop, the internet team, or the team in our Tokyo and Hong Kong offices, or our Dublin store - throughout the company we are trying to educate the staff so they are equally able to care for our customers. That was always the key philosophy of the company towards wine. In other words, we’re only going to sell spirits that we ourselves enjoy drinking.

GrainMash : Does that mean that the BBR whisky range has its own particular style or signature?

Doug McIvor : Well, the BBR range that i look after? I like balance in a whisky. Whereas some people love heavy heavy sherry casks, I prefer to lose the heavier influences and try to have something subtle. The key to me is a balance of aroma, flavour and finish, but the real key is a really good mouth feel. If it’s all over too quickly, you lose most of what you are trying to achieve, and I like something that you can really chew for a long time before you swallow.

GrainMash : So, if your perfect whisky was a type of food, what would it be?

Doug McIvor : Well with whiskies, it’s a mood thing, the same as food. So whilst I might fancy a curry one night or a salad Nicoise another, it’s much the same with single malts. The analogy I would rather use is that when you get home in the evening, depending upon the kind of day you’ve had, you would know what you wanted to listen to. So perhaps you choose Sade for the mellow evening. The larger your knowledge of music, the larger your knowledge of single malts, the more your range will be refined. So, on a mellow evening perhaps it’s Neil Diamond and a mellow Speyside, whereas for Led Zeppelin perhaps a boisterous Islay would be better.

GrainMash : That’s a lot of fun, thank you. How many whiskies do you keep at home?

Doug McIvor : I’ve only got one on the go at home right now. And that’s a Black Adder smoking Islay, a cask strength, which was given to me by Robin Tucek when we were together earlier this year in Sweden. It’s just the perfect kind of warming dram for this weather! (This interview took place during the period of London’s heaviest snowfall in 16 years!)

GrainMash : And if someone put a gun to your head and asked for your “favourite” whisky?

Doug McIvor : It would be a Caol Ila. We do a few under Berry’s Own Selection, so I have a good supply to hand.
GrainMash : Last time I was here, Edward (Edward Bates) very kindly gave me half a bottle of Berry Brothers’ Blue Hanger Scots Whisky, the 4th Edition. Does that have a Caol Ila influence?

Doug McIver : No, that’s purely Speyside. There is a bit of smokiness, but I think that came through from a few of the older Speysides that were in there. It is actually made up from Glenlivet, Glen Elgin and Mortlach.

GrainMash : I noticed that it was a little cloudy too. Can you explain why?

Doug McIvor : It’s the natural colour. It’s non chill-filtered, so if the whisky gets a little cold it is going to cloud a little bit. Given the time of year it’s perfectly natural to have a bit of cloud in a whisky, and it actually means you’re getting a little more of the authentic flavour from the casks. Our whiskies have a mesh filtration to take out the rusty nails and tree trunks, but we try to leave as much of the authenticity in the whisky as we can.

Most of the proprietary larger brands will “colour adjust” the whisky to keep a uniformity. If you see two bottles side by side in a supermarket and they are different colours, you may be put off, but we try to give the best experience we can in terms of flavour.

GrainMash : How does the economic environment affect your decisions?

Doug McIvor : There is not much we can do. Whisky is a long term thing. There are casks being laid down at present and it could be 10 years before they see the light of day. So you have to take the longer view anyway, and the whisky industry has always been pretty far sighted. The combination of that and the fact Berry Brothers is a 310 year old company means we are looking well down the line into the future to develop the business.


GrainMash : What about from the world market perspective?

Doug McIvor : Well Japan is obviously in recession, but we have aspiration and specialist products, so it would naturally be the wealthier or enthusiasts who buy from BBR, as something to savour. And of course the weakness of the pound and comparative strength of the Euro has helped sales into Europe, particularly France, Holland and Germany.

Going forward, although we’ve been independent bottlers for over 100 years, we have only recently taken Berry Brothers’ own by the scruff of the neck and developed the range and there are still lots of different markets. So, dynamic markets like China and India are very interesting. But we’re trying to make sure our product goes to the right partners and the right places.

GrainMash : In terms of Investment whiskies, would you make any recommendations?

Doug McIvor : I am not really the best person to ask, because i don’t have a collectors’ mentality. But going back to the old days, people who picked up Black Bowmore for £90.00 are doing well because they change hands for £2000 plus now. I think too many distilleries are bringing out too many different products too quickly at this time.

GrainMash : And finally Doug, what can Grainmash bring to the industry, in your opinion?

Doug McIvor : Marketing is still marketing. To bring in the next generation, one side of the coin is looking to ensure the drink responsibly message is felt – but at Berry Brothers we are at the high end. We’re not targeting the 16 year old outside the chippy in Sunderland!

I think the site needs to reflect a little personality. There are lots of great characters in the industry, strong brand ambassadors like BBR’s very own Ronnie Cox, writers such as Dave Broom and Jim Murray and retailers such as Richard Joynson of Loch Fyne Whiskies in Inverurie. Richard started the Scotch Whisky Review a few years ago and it can be pretty tongue in cheek!

GrainMash : Doug, thank you so much for taking the time to talk to GrainMash today. Next time, I think we should really focus on your expertise at the cask and barrel level. Speaking of tongue in cheek, it’s been a long time since you sold coffee at BBR, and one would imagine that the Queen’s off license could afford a new sign by now!

© 2009 GrainMash.